|  | Topic : Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help |  |
| | | mjgt | | Thor |  |  | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 24 Mar 2012 - 18:20 Post title : Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help | | | When I started to ride I had a Honda CB175 and I very quickly found that bikers waved and helped each other out. I ran out of petrol on the A38 just outside Plymouth and a bloke on a Norton Commando stopped to help. He ran me to the nearest garage and waited till I had a can of fuel before taking me back to my bike and making sure my bike would start. He turned out to be a freind of a freind who was a member of the Aquilla (Plymouth HA) but it was no trouble to help me out.
Later I had a Suzuki GT250 which also ran out of fuel (only cos I was'nt quick enough to switch to reserve before stopping) but again another biker stopped to help and made sure I was OK before moving off, and this was my experience in my early days of riding and I have been helped out a few more times so I always stop to help others if I see them stranded.
Over the last 15 years or so I have been fortunate enough to be able to own decent, reliable bikes and I never (kiss of death) run out of fuel but have not forgotten my early days and always stop to help others. However I am starting to think that with modern bikes I end up stopping for nothing and often people think I am a weirdo, they stop for a fag and some random bloke turns up asking if they are OK. When I tell them why i've stopped they always thank me as if it's the first time it's ever happened.
My point is that some people dont stop in a latby to have a smoke they just pull over, I've stopped to help a lad on a roundabout but he was just having a smoke as was a lad on a motorway slip road so I am starting to think I should just ride by unless it's patently obvious.
Has anyone else noticed this and what do you do? or is it just me?
| Mick . . .  Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | Bedouin | | Jupiter | |  | | Reg. Date | : | 18/10/2008 | | Posts | : | 1,066 | | Location | : | Athens, Greece |
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| | Posted : 24 Mar 2012 - 18:39 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | Mjgt, thanks for being the first to contribute to this section.
As you will notice I have edited the heading as mentioned in the outline I posted in order that we can keep track of each member's stories.
I have found that over the years the younger riders aren't as willing to stop to help as much as the old dogs.
I guess it has something to do with how one sees himself as a biker and the level of solidarity one feels towards the sport/hobby and brethren.
It reminds me of a short story I posted a few years ago. I'll copy and paste it here in a few minutes.
| Blessed are those eyes that have seen more roads than any man! (Homer).
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| | | Agent86 | | Set | |  | | Reg. Date | : | 17/02/2012 | | Posts | : | 361 | | Location | : | Australia |
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| | Posted : 24 Apr 2012 - 22:54 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: Bedouin) | | | Sorry if this is a little off topic but on all my rides or should I say travels by car or bike here in Australia I have noticed a seemingly lack
Of younger riders. Was driving home the other day from Melbourne with 2 of my sons & wife in the car & stopped to buy some highly over
priced fuel & there was a group of 7 or 8 bikes & riders stopped having a break at the petrol station & my wife commented heap of old guys
on bikes again. Now I would guess the average age of this group would have been around 55 - 60, i'am almost 50 so not that far off me, I started
thinking which usually doesn't end well, & concluded she was right, go to a moto cross meet or most competive bike things & most are young riders
for obvious reasons but a lot don't seem to transfer to the road untill they are older. Has anyone else noticed the road rider population seems to be
ageing with a bit of a gap of younger riders appearing.
| Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity .
2012 storm, re - ground cams, ported head, power commander, short tors, high flow filter & Meerkat cat bypass..
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| | | Leethal | | Zeus | |  | | Reg. Date | : | 24/01/2011 | | Posts | : | 6,407 | | Location | : | Australia |
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| | Posted : 25 Apr 2012 - 06:03 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | Lead the way Mick, keep doing what you have been, the young ones just might learn something.
| Experience is something you get just after you needed it 
1600,Foran Razorbacks, Meerkat bypass, Dyno tune, real headlight,plenty of chrome,switchblade pegs, Hagon Nitro shocks & Ikon progressive fork springs etc. Scorpion Western Low handlebars. PH adjustable fork caps.
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 25 Apr 2012 - 16:35 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: Agent86) | | | Yes I have noticed that most lads on bikes these days are clocking on some, when I started most other bikers were my age but then the kids came along and so the bike had to go to be replaced by nappies, sick and a car. Most don't ever return, those that do bring a pair of rose tinted glasses, a goatee and a beer gut. 
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | TBRider | | Chaac | |  | | Reg. Date | : | 21/10/2011 | | Posts | : | 834 | | Location | : | Foothills, The Mountains, United States |
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| | Posted : 25 Apr 2012 - 17:53 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | mjgt, I used to see this allot in the 80's when I was stationed in the UK. I always stopped just to be friendly and see if they needed any assistance. It's a good thing actually, you never know. Mostly seemed to happen at Norman Cross on the A-1 heading off to Yaxley on the A-15 for some reason.
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 25 Apr 2012 - 18:00 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: TBRider) | | | Where were you stationed, we ran a hog in the late 80's and used to hang around with some of the lads from lakenheath, Jack and Glo come to mind?
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | zolti | | Thor | |  | | Reg. Date | : | 23/03/2010 | | Posts | : | 3,127 | | Location | : | newcastle , United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 25 Apr 2012 - 18:21 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | |
mjgt wrote:
Has anyone else noticed this and what do you do? or is it just me? |
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i have noticed older riders ( always sports bikes ) frequenting laybys and gate posts, but as they ususlly wave in the customary way and not "stop im in need of help"
i assume its either a fag, sore wrists or aching back they have stopped for.
i do slow but never felt that they are in need.
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| | | TBRider | | Chaac | | | | Reg. Date | : | 21/10/2011 | | Posts | : | 834 | | Location | : | Foothills, The Mountains, United States |
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| | Posted : 25 Apr 2012 - 19:14 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | I was at Alconbury and Molesworth. My wife, children and I lived in Peterborugh and drove the distance everyday to and from the base. We lived very close to the Orton Fair Grounds off the A-1 and played on the Riley's Pool & Snooker Club team (Formally the Orton Snooker Center). Played on the Peterbrough Snooker Club Team at the Riley's Club for a short period also.
In fact I still remember the address;
86 Brudnell,
Orton Goldhay Way,
Peterbrough, Cambs, PE2 5SY, UK
Fancy that! There was some new council housing the based helped build and we decided to live there, instead of on the base, in Alconbury Village or Sawtry. There was a nice shopping center the Orton Center where we did most all our shopping.
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| | | weasel | | Set | | | Reg. Date | : | 14/02/2012 | | Posts | : | 150 | | Location | : | Thornbury,Bristol, South Gloucestershire, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 25 Apr 2012 - 19:48 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | sounds like me but no glasses , cant afford rose tinted ones. Beer gut costs alot thou.
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ride till your tyres fall off
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| | | Agent86 | | Set | | | | Reg. Date | : | 17/02/2012 | | Posts | : | 361 | | Location | : | Australia |
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| | Posted : 26 Apr 2012 - 04:09 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: weasel) | | |
weasel wrote:
sounds like me but no glasses , cant afford rose tinted ones. Beer gut costs alot thou. |
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+1 for maintaining the beer gut, doesn't just happen you know, you have to work at it. Thinking
about the high percentage of older riders I wonder if the increased revenue raising cameras &
general public attitude towards breaking the silly speed limits has anything to do with younger
riders just passing on bikes altogether , speed & power are a big attraction when you are younger
seem to need to be a bit older to appreciate the other great aspects of motorcycling,
just a though probably wrong usually are.
| Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity .
2012 storm, re - ground cams, ported head, power commander, short tors, high flow filter & Meerkat cat bypass..
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 26 Apr 2012 - 14:48 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: zolti) | | |
zolti wrote:
mjgt wrote:
Has anyone else noticed this and what do you do? or is it just me? |
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i have noticed older riders ( always sports bikes ) frequenting laybys and gate posts, but as they ususlly wave in the customary way and not "stop im in need of help"
i assume its either a fag, sore wrists or aching back they have stopped for.
i do slow but never felt that they are in need.
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I would'nt mind if they just waved "hi fellow biker"  or signalled "help" in some way but they just watch as I roll up to offer help before telling me it's a fag break, sore back break or sore wrists, especially when it's not in a normal parking place. i.e on the side of the road or on a roundabout.
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 26 Apr 2012 - 14:53 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: Agent86) | | |
Agent86 wrote:
weasel wrote:
sounds like me but no glasses , cant afford rose tinted ones. Beer gut costs alot thou. |
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+1 for maintaining the beer gut, doesn't just happen you know, you have to work at it. Thinking
about the high percentage of older riders I wonder if the increased revenue raising cameras &
general public attitude towards breaking the silly speed limits has anything to do with younger
riders just passing on bikes altogether , speed & power are a big attraction when you are younger
seem to need to be a bit older to appreciate the other great aspects of motorcycling,
just a though probably wrong usually are. |
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Oh, I don't know when I was 22 I bought the fastest most powerfull bike in creation, a Suzuki gsx1100f and I rode it hard, nothig got past unless I let it. Then the ZZR1100 came along and stopped all that fun so I stopped chasing the horizon. These days I just enjoy riding and Hi speed does'nt do it for me, and it's nos I is old (before anyone chips in)
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | Calveitro | | Set | | | Reg. Date | : | 09/04/2011 | | Posts | : | 196 | | Location | : | Dongara, Western Australaia, Australia |
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| | Posted : 29 Apr 2012 - 18:11 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | |
mjgt wrote:
Agent86 wrote:
weasel wrote:
sounds like me but no glasses , cant afford rose tinted ones. Beer gut costs alot thou. |
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+1 for maintaining the beer gut, doesn't just happen you know, you have to work at it. Thinking
about the high percentage of older riders I wonder if the increased revenue raising cameras &
general public attitude towards breaking the silly speed limits has anything to do with younger
riders just passing on bikes altogether , speed & power are a big attraction when you are younger
seem to need to be a bit older to appreciate the other great aspects of motorcycling,
just a though probably wrong usually are. |
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Oh, I don't know when I was 22 I bought the fastest most powerfull bike in creation, a Suzuki gsx1100f and I rode it hard, nothig got past unless I let it. Then the ZZR1100 came along and stopped all that fun so I stopped chasing the horizon. These days I just enjoy riding and Hi speed does'nt do it for me, and it's nos I is old (before anyone chips in) |
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Just a couple of thoughts. I spent a month on the road last year and got to meet a lot of riders out on the road. Most of the cruiser riders I met were around my age (50 or so). Similar age, similar bikes so we would stop and chat. The younger guys were out there but they were flashing past on the sports bikes and sports tourers. Not riding in the slow lane like me and the cruiser riders.
I stopped for a coffee in a small town in Tasmania. 20 or so bikes turned up (all sports bikes). A couple of them wandered over to say hello to the grey haired cruiser rider (my WA plates made me interesting) but most stopped, fueled up and got back on the road.
Cruisers are about getting there eventualy and the young guys on sports bikes are about getting there right now.
Cruiser riders and sports bike riders are just demographics that don't mix. When I was 17 on my GS1000 I'd fang it up to the local bike meeting place. Usualy a coffee shop at the top of a long, tight, mountain road. There would be 50 sports bikes parked up and not one cruiser in sight. They were off somewhere else.
Nowadays I'm getting old and slow and I'm kicking back having a Latte with the other cruiser riders. The young riders are still out there but they are hanging at the places I would have been at 35 years ago. Rimatukas, Akaroa pub, reefton and black spur were the places to be, and probably still are but they aint the kind of places most people take a cruiser on a sunday.
Got to admit though that high speed does still do it for me. Just a memory now but tucked in at 270km/h chasing the bike in front on a public road is a rush that is hard to replicate. The thunderbird is never going to be able to replace that feeling. I'm currently working on rebuilding a Katana. 1260 motor, FS carbs, stronger frame and all CF bodywork. A bike from my mispent youth but this time with some serious get up and go.
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 30 Apr 2012 - 06:36 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: Calveitro) | | | I know what you are saying Peter but I also ride streetfighters and musclebikes but still find the same thing, I think the biggest difference is the numbers I see, less people of any age are riding bikes now so it's probably more important to stick together before we become a thing of the past, part of history, like an outside bog, although I believe you boys in Auz still have em
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | Birdy68 | | Thor | |  | | Reg. Date | : | 16/07/2009 | | Posts | : | 3,352 | | Location | : | Bad Zurzach, Aargau, Switzerland |
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| | Posted : 15 May 2012 - 12:45 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: Agent86) | | | Agent86 wrote:
.... I wonder if the increased revenue raising cameras & general public attitude towards breaking the silly speed limits has anything to do with younger riders just passing on bikes altogether , speed & power are a big attraction when you are younger seem to need to be a bit older to appreciate the other great aspects of motorcycling... |
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What can I say....? I'm 44 this year, and only been riding since 2008 (4 seasons).
But the one thing that goes through my mind is...
I bought the 'Bird to find what it is I WANT, LOVE, NEED, FEEL ~ Live MY dreams.
I feel the kids of today buy a bike thinking (read as 'hoping') what the others will be WANTING. LOVING, NEEDING, FEELING ~ live the OTHERS dreams.
I see it in my little boys style of life ~ "What is it what the others would like...."
I keep telling/asking him (last Sunday afternoon actually), "Who are YOU? Who do YOU want to be?"
I think at some point in our lives we stop wanting/having to try and be accepted (read as 'fit into the social system') and start looking for the things that actually mean something.... MEMORIES. SMILES. (TRUE) FRIENDS.
Just my 2p.
| Birdy68
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Leave the pork pies for now - get the sausage rolls while they're hot!
 -x-  -x- 
more info at Fuelly.com
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| | | Tilinghetuna | | Set | |  | | Reg. Date | : | 21/05/2011 | | Posts | : | 196 | | Location | : | Nottingham, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 15 May 2012 - 12:50 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: Birdy68) | | |
Birdy68 wrote:
Agent86 wrote:
.... I wonder if the increased revenue raising cameras & general public attitude towards breaking the silly speed limits has anything to do with younger riders just passing on bikes altogether , speed & power are a big attraction when you are younger seem to need to be a bit older to appreciate the other great aspects of motorcycling... |
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What can I say....? I'm 44 this year, and only been riding since 2008 (4 seasons).
But the one thing that goes through my mind is...
I bought the 'Bird to find what it is I WANT, LOVE, NEED, FEEL ~ Live MY dreams.
I feel the kids of today buy a bike thinking (read as 'hoping') what the others will be WANTING. LOVING, NEEDING, FEELING ~ live the OTHERS dreams.
I see it in my little boys style of life ~ "What is it what the others would like...."
I keep telling/asking him (last Sunday afternoon actually), "Who are YOU? Who do YOU want to be?"
I think at some point in our lives we stop wanting/having to try and be accepted (read as 'fit into the social system') and start looking for the things that actually mean something.... MEMORIES. SMILES. (TRUE) FRIENDS.
Just my 2p.
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Thats more than 2p worth!
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Tilinghetuna = Settlement of Tir's people
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 15 May 2012 - 18:26 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: Tilinghetuna) | | | 
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 15 Sep 2012 - 00:15 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | Having said that I always stop to offer help to other bikers and on occasion I have stopped to help a car I had no such luck today when a blind woman knocked me off my bike on a busy roundabout in weston super mare today. Not one car or bike stopped to offer help or act as a witness.
The car was in the left hand lane, I was in the right hand lane just as I tipped in to take the exit she decided that she was in the wrong lane and turned and started to signal at the same time, I caught sight of here moving accross me and got the bike up straight and slowed a little but could not avoid the impact and went into her door and down onto the road.
Only good thing (if you can call it that) is that I was not on my bird, I was on my Suzuki GSX 1400, and the woman put her hands up straight away, lets hope she still feels that way when the insurance man comes a knocking.
I don't think it will stop me from offering help to others though.
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | weasel | | Set | | | Reg. Date | : | 14/02/2012 | | Posts | : | 150 | | Location | : | Thornbury,Bristol, South Gloucestershire, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 15 Sep 2012 - 17:56 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | Sorry to hear that mate , more to the point are you ok ? Have had a couple of near misses meself the last couple o weeks , with older people , pottering around far far less than the speed limit and then just pulling off willy nilly and they dont even look in there mirrors or indicate , I would like to say its mostly the women , but unfortunately its not , and pulling straight out of junctions is another one of there specialities .
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ride till your tyres fall off
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| | | mat1600 | | Thunderbird | |  | | Reg. Date | : | 06/03/2010 | | Posts | : | 8,596 | | Location | : | Bridlington, Democratic Independant State of Yorkshire, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 15 Sep 2012 - 19:01 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | |
mjgt wrote:
Having said that I always stop to offer help to other bikers and on occasion I have stopped to help a car I had no such luck today when a blind woman knocked me off my bike on a busy roundabout in weston super mare today. Not one car or bike stopped to offer help or act as a witness.
The car was in the left hand lane, I was in the right hand lane just as I tipped in to take the exit she decided that she was in the wrong lane and turned and started to signal at the same time, I caught sight of here moving accross me and got the bike up straight and slowed a little but could not avoid the impact and went into her door and down onto the road.
Only good thing (if you can call it that) is that I was not on my bird, I was on my Suzuki GSX 1400, and the woman put her hands up straight away, lets hope she still feels that way when the insurance man comes a knocking.
I don't think it will stop me from offering help to others though. |
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Shit. Bad news mate. Did you get any injuries and how bad was the bike ?
| My first natural instinct is to breathe. My second is to evade tax's.
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 16 Sep 2012 - 09:25 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: weasel) | | |
weasel wrote:
Sorry to hear that mate , more to the point are you ok ? Have had a couple of near misses meself the last couple o weeks , with older people , pottering around far far less than the speed limit and then just pulling off willy nilly and they dont even look in there mirrors or indicate , I would like to say its mostly the women , but unfortunately its not , and pulling straight out of junctions is another one of there specialities . |
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Thanks Pete, I am fine but sandra has sprained her wrist but thats all, just pissed that my bike got spanked. The last time a car hit me was 37 years ago and that was in waston and again not my fault. Catch up with you later, we should go out before the shit weather takes hold.
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 16 Sep 2012 - 09:29 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mat1600) | | |
mat1600 wrote:
mjgt wrote:
Having said that I always stop to offer help to other bikers and on occasion I have stopped to help a car I had no such luck today when a blind woman knocked me off my bike on a busy roundabout in weston super mare today. Not one car or bike stopped to offer help or act as a witness.
The car was in the left hand lane, I was in the right hand lane just as I tipped in to take the exit she decided that she was in the wrong lane and turned and started to signal at the same time, I caught sight of here moving accross me and got the bike up straight and slowed a little but could not avoid the impact and went into her door and down onto the road.
Only good thing (if you can call it that) is that I was not on my bird, I was on my Suzuki GSX 1400, and the woman put her hands up straight away, lets hope she still feels that way when the insurance man comes a knocking.
I don't think it will stop me from offering help to others though. |
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Shit. Bad news mate. Did you get any injuries and how bad was the bike ? |
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Thanks mat, no injuries to me or her but the bike has busted clocks, headlight and bars mainly. My crash bobbins did their job but my bloody arai took a biffin as well which really pissed me off. Bike gets picked up tomorrow for her trip to the hospital, should be back in less than a month.
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | weasel | | Set | | | Reg. Date | : | 14/02/2012 | | Posts | : | 150 | | Location | : | Thornbury,Bristol, South Gloucestershire, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 16 Sep 2012 - 09:57 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | Thats ok mate , yes we should get out , lets go over the bridge next sunday if the weather is good. And Sandra spraining her wrist , is that an old injury from when , wait for it ! she fell off the tbird in Minehead? , I think she might have been drunk the way she dismounted that day , and no bikers helped her then either, we all stood about laughin.Anyway the main thing is your both ok and bikes can be fixed.Drop me a pm next week mate.
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ride till your tyres fall off
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 16 Sep 2012 - 10:01 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: weasel) | | | I keep her drugged up
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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| | | mjgt | | Thor | | | | Reg. Date | : | 16/09/2011 | | Posts | : | 2,201 | | Location | : | North Somerset, United Kingdom |
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| | Posted : 20 Sep 2012 - 16:06 Post title : Re: Mjgt - SS nr 1 - Roadside help (Re: mjgt) | | | Just got a call from the repair centre asking if I want the repairs to go ahead as they have the final estimate of the work required, £3,500. I told them I only wanted it repaired not gold plated, they said thats all you are going to get and thats the cost, someone is making a lot of money out of this, lucky for me it's not me that's paying. All I need now if the driver of the car to admit liability or for my legal team to proove it was her fault so I don't loose my excess or no claims, as she had to cross white lines to get me I don't see how she can say it's not her fault.
| Mick . . . Keep the rubber side down!!
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